Sneak preview of Gnome 2.10

You don't need to use just one locale.

Just set LANG=en_GB.UTF-8
and set LC_TIME=en_US.UTF-8

I'm sure that fixes it, at least it should.

Really, damn I live here and always thought it started on monday ????
[The windows one does, as I look] and I'm sure all the calendars you buy here start on a monday?

The "theoretical correct start day of a week" should be Sunday, I believe.

Yes, please I really have been waiting forever for this (y it's sad; but I *like* eyecandy... but stopped using Enlightenment about 6 years ago :(

Check out E17 current development packages, screenshots, features. Its getting there finally, very interesting. Although i just don't get wether their terminal (still Eterm? CVS version? or..?) supports composite, and exactly how. See enlightenment.org, rasterman.com or xcomputerman.org for some info, screenshots, etcetera.

Heh, I've been watching the development of E 17 for years and it is exciting, but all I want really these days is quite boring things in the main...
I always thought it'd be cool to do a light enlightenment "enlitenment?" which was just the windowmanager... I like the gnome widgets and don't need a whole extra DE... (also it'd be cool if they seperate out the desktop effects (ripples and reflection) in the new version... ah well it'll be a while before E17 appears anyway

There's a spiffifity branch in Metacity CVS and there's Luminocity. I've heard of some other development efforts (which aren't available in CVS AFAIK), but none of these things are being released for general consumption yet (nor is there really a timetable for it yet)...

You're not referring to the built-in "compositor" for metacity are you? I sincerely hope that efforts will be made to replace that thing, as it's totally unusable

"Your first version wasn't perfect, we obviously have to rip out the whole thing and restart."

I suppose I shouldn't claim to know what's wrong with it. All I do know is that while xcompmgr provided liquid smooth drop shadows and 3d effects, metacity brought my system to its knees and all windows looked like they were surrounded by black boxes. I'd love to see this be fixed, as Metacity is my favorite window manager.

Yeah, there's definitely problems with Metacity's compositing manager. But that's just because it hasn't received much attention (personally, I've been busy on focus bugs and other random fixes from old bugzilla bugs and haven't yet looked at the compositor). Until the last few days, there had only been a couple commits over the last year or so, and it was never to the point where it was "ready", which is why it's off currently. Note the following comment from configure.in for Metacity (and this is still here in CVS HEAD):

echo "Not building compositing manager by default now, must enable explicitly to get it. And it doesn't work, so don't bother unless you want to hack on it..."

But the fact that it doesn't work yet, just means that it needs to be completed and fixed, not that it needs to be ripped out. ;-)

The Enlightenment guys made a few benchmarks concerning their composite implementation versus the FD.o one. You might be surprised by the results of that (hint: the FD.o one sucked). Leaves room for lots of improvements, aye?

if you were a developer you would know that optimaztion is always the LAST thing you do, so doing speed comparisons on a project that is still being developed, compared to a library thats been aroudn for years, in its SECOND MAJOR RELEASE is pretty much meaningless. given some time to mature Xorg will be performing on par with imlib, and i'd put money on that.

Boohoohoo. He made a compare, and it doesn't suit my politcal agenda! Lets flame him!

I'm no developer indeed, but i'm helping a friend with some development-related aspects (testing, porting, and other). He's designing the software from the ground, and he doesn't actually say his software is ready for prime time and optimized. He's optimizing code which is *ready* though.

Compare that to X.Org; i'm sorry, but i was under the impression that this was production-quality code. Apparently its still beta quality then, and it still needs lots of speed-wise improvements, aye?

i'm sorry, but i was under the impression that this was production-quality code. Apparently its still beta quality then, and it still needs lots of speed-wise improvements

I think you may have misunderstood the reasoning why the composite extension is off by default then.

Check out the Release Notes, especially the part where it says:

The Composite extension is considered experimental in X11R6.8.1 and is turned off by default.

X.org isn't necessarily beta quality, you just fail to see the fact that the composite and damage extensions are still under much development. There really is no point in calling the whole thing being beta then, now is there? I just think the composite and damage extensions are a good thing, but they are really a bit slow. This will hopefully improve with time..
-WareKala

Enlightenment doesn't have a Composite implementation as far as I know. If you're refering to imlib2 VS xrender, that's something else....I think. :)

Dyou have a link for this?

Gee... thanks for the page widening post that makes it virtually impossible to read all the messages on this page.

This feature comes from the editor in eclipse.

jEdit had it years ago

Nobody cares who had it first. Big deal.

I don't like the all-in-one approach of gedit. There should be a barebones dumbed down text editor and another one for programmers. Gedit is slow and often needlessly complicated.

Even some... well, much GNOME developers use Emacs. If we had Gedit as the only Gnome editor, It should have this functionalities only as pluggins.

Eduardo de Oliveira Padoan
http://edcrypt.cjb.net

Yeah. Gedit became very slow, even with all the extra functions off, it takes over 5 seconds to start. Truly minimal editors like leafpad pop up instantly. There really should be an editor just like notepad, extremely fast and simple, just for editing text files.

But it does have nice charset detection features.

Hm I use gedit oftern to write my latex or xml code. For c, php, java, fortan etc. I prefer a real developer editor e.g. emacs. And normally it feels fine for me. Using it on a AMD K6-450 wie 384 MB RAM.

Well there are situations where the editor is too slow. That is when I use it as PHP-editor. It often has problems changing the colors in syntax-highlighting-mode.

Oh, NO!

Look at KDE, with their 400+ version of each app...

They have THREE(!!!) text editors in the distribution (Ok, maybe I'm jumping to conclusions, and it's just the Gentoo version, but still, it's horrible!)

I wanted to try out KDE, but I just got lost in the tons of crap in there... The configuration manager is just scary to look at!

Sometimes I think GNOME is a wee bit too minimalistic, but KDE is just ridiculous...

BTW, why do you think GEdit is slow? It's very fast on my computer (Pentium-M 1500), startup is instant, and nothing is lagging using it... And my harddrive is only a 4200, which normally makes startup times VERY long...

gedit is a fine editor, so is kate. I have to use kate at university because gnome/gedit is not installed. And I have some experience with kate now. The university version of it has some problems with utf8 but that might not be a general bug. I guess it is a problem with the installation. So there is no good reason for KDE bashing. Well even if kate and or kedit where both crap. This would still be no reason at all.

Also I want to remind you about the point, that gnome likes to have a "tool for each problem"-design and KDE has/had a tendency to use bulk ware. All in one solutions for short.

Nevertheless I prefer gnome though its simplicity. But others prefer KDE for their own good reasons.

You're lucky. The most modern Windows Manager that my university has is Motif. And it's an old version that doesn't support virtual desktop. We uses vi or emacs here.

Infantile KDE bashing.. alright....

Reminds me a course I'm taking where all that's done is to bash science as the great satan in order to legitimize another viewpoint. Unforunately it utter fails and takes away from the good points of their perspectives.

They're BOTH freakin' free. Use whatever the hell you want. Apparently you like GNOME, go nutz. I don't wear my DE on my sleeve, I just use what works.

Some performance problems in gedit (e.g. wrapping of loooong lines) are problems in pango AFAIK. While i use gedit every day better performance is never wrong ...

http://tarot.freeshell.org/leafpad/

Essentially Notepad in GTK

seriously I have had no problem with clipboards ever. I don't understand what the problem is.

Try copying text from gedit, close gedit and then paste it in another app. It doesn't work. The copied text has wanished. This is also true with for example gaim chat windows. Very irritating at times.

You know, I will agree that there are some problems with cut-n-paste between applications. However, I think clipboard persistence is an extremely minor issue. Back in the single desktop, low resolution, apps take up the entire screen, and multitasking sucks days, you needed to be able to paste clipboard data after closing an application. But, aside from habit, why is this an issue now? Just minimize the application, or resize the window, or use another virtual desktop. Sure, it is a bit of an annoyance when you accidently close the application before pasting. But it is an annoyance...I can't think of a situation where you would have to close the application before pasting. Should it be fixed eventually? Yes. But I don't think we need to go hacking something together because this is a feature needed immediately. I am happy waiting until a good solution can be engineered.

Well, application providing context disappeared, so did clipboard. You didn't know that? Xwindow worked that way for 18 years! It's obvious.

--
:wq

"It's been sucking for 18 years, why break a streak". With a clipboard daemon there wouldn't be this problem.

Don't close the app before pasting

I don't see this as a problem.

--
:wq

No, thats because you *know* how it works and why it is so! Many people dont and can't figure out why cut'n'paste works sometimes and sometimes not.

Don't do that elite attitude, because not everyone has been using X for 18 years. Especially not many in the target audience for GNOME...

Uhm, sorry if I sounded bad.
But thinking more, the current behaviour even match real world so it is better as a metaphore.
What do I mean? Imagine two application windows as a drawers. You can move things (cut-paste) from on to another. But if you close one window, it is like closing one drawer. You can no longer take things from closed drawer in real world. You can no longer copy nonexistant text.

--
:wq

This is a ridiculously complicated and contrived metaphor - nobody is going to be thinking this way when using a desktop computer. All people want is to be able to copy text around, which seems like a reasonable expectation. It definitely needs to be worked on...